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Pars v Killie

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31 minutes ago, Digs said:

Want/Expect - Tomato/Tomatoe - Either way, what you want, and what is possible are two mutually exclusive entities.

So you're saying if we go on a run of 5 wins on the bounce, that is unacceptable? Cool. Makes perfect sense now.

I'm not sure what more could be done if we take a maximum of 15 points from 15. You forget to factor in that we wouldn't just be gaining points, we would be beating the teams above us to do so, meaning they would be losing ground to us in real terms. 

 

It was possible for us to win every single game so far this season(individually obviously before you try to make it sound like I expect maximum points),  the only reason we have failed in that is peter grant. We're not playing against champions league sides.

Teams above us can get point other weeks you know, just cos we beat them one week doesn't mean they can't win the next.   

If we win the next 5 on the bounce(which right now is fantasy land stuff) then in context of the full season so far grant will still be behind where he should be.  

I'm not saying he can never get to a point where he'll reach an acceptable position, I'm just saying what it will take for him to achieve that,  we can make our own judgements on if we consider that realistic.   As said if he wins the next 6 that will have got slightly above the minimum standard. if we get 10 wins from the next 10 he'll have got himself close to the maximum we can achieve, which is 2 points a game.   

In case you missed it.  We're further behind 1st than before the weekend, and the same distance to 4th.  No ground gained which is something we need to do if were going to do anything positive this season

We're closer to safety which I am delighted about,  unfortunately that is now the current aim.   IF (and it's a huge IF) we succeed at that this season Grant will still have likely failed in his objective.   I see no reason why we should be hanging around to wait and see just how badly he fails before getting a proper manager in.

Edited by parsforlife
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37 minutes ago, parsforlife said:

It was possible for us to win every single game so far this season(individually obviously before you try to make it sound like I expect maximum points),  the only reason we have failed in that is peter grant. We're not playing against champions league sides.

Teams above us can get point other weeks you know, just cos we beat them one week doesn't mean they can't win the next.   

If we win the next 5 on the bounce(which right now is fantasy land stuff) then in context of the full season so far grant will still be behind where he should be.  

I'm not saying he can never get to a point where he'll reach an acceptable position, I'm just saying what it will take for him to achieve that,  we can make our own judgements on if we consider that realistic.   As said if he wins the next 6 that will have got slightly above the minimum standard. if we get 10 wins from the next 10 he'll have got himself close to the maximum we can achieve, which is 2 points a game.   

In case you missed it.  We're further behind 1st than before the weekend, and the same distance to 4th.  No ground gained which is something we need to do if were going to do anything positive this season

We're closer to safety which I am delighted about,  unfortunately that is now the current aim.   IF (and it's a huge IF) we succeed at that this season Grant will still have likely failed in his objective.   I see no reason why we should be hanging around to wait and see just how badly he fails before getting a proper manager in.

None of which has anything to do with your original point that I criticised. Where you disagreed with someone who said they go to be entertained and you said you go to see your team win. 

you’ve went so far off your own point in a thread that is not even about the stuff you’re talking about in order for you to come back from something you said that I took issue with. 
There are plenty of open threads already discussing the things you’re talking about.

Saturday wasn’t, and isn’t, an embarrassing failure and the spin you put on the result was just so you could shoehorn the discussion round to something else. 

In my only response to the above, that I’ve highlighted, because this thread is going OT, my reply to you is that you should apply the same reasoning to your own point. They will also drop more points to each other too. 
 

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8 minutes ago, Digs said:

None of which has anything to do with your original point that I criticised. Where you disagreed with someone who said they go to be entertained and you said you go to see your team win. 

you’ve went so far off your own point in a thread that is not even about the stuff you’re talking about in order for you to come back from something you said that I took issue with. 
There are plenty of open threads already discussing the things you’re talking about.

Saturday wasn’t, and isn’t, an embarrassing failure and the spin you put on the result was just so you could shoehorn the discussion round to something else. 

In my only response to the above, that I’ve highlighted, because this thread is going OT, my reply to you is that you should apply the same reasoning to your own point. They will also drop more points to each other too. 
 

You have made most of that up in your head.

You didn't like that I called our inability to win at the 9th(ninth!) attempt embarrassing, because you want to treat every game individually and ignore the context of the season.  I consider things in the greater picture. 

We have no control over what other teams do,  they'll gain points against each other, they'll drop points against each other.  I wouldn't argue they can all win every week cos that's stupid, nor can they all lose.  What we do know is that the team in 4th place will have something approaching 27 points, maybe a bit more, maybe a bit less by the end of the next quarter, the team at the top will have roughly 36 and the ones near the bottom will be on about 16/17.  This doesn't change much season on season,  baring extreme Brechin like performances. 

Sorry for talking about anything other that didn't occur between 3 and 5 on saturday,  as this website must be neatly separated into nice little boxes...

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22 minutes ago, The Roy Barry Fan Club said:

Sorry: just catching up with this discussion: 

As a matter of interest, are you saying that I shouldn't have found Saturday's game entertaining? 

Were you at East End for the game?

No.

I was at east end.  Many did seem happy with Saturday,  But for me it missed the most crucial bit.  Football is all about winning.  You can have as many entertaining draws as you like, you won't ever get success with that.

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46 minutes ago, parsforlife said:

No.

I was at east end.  Many did seem happy with Saturday,  But for me it missed the most crucial bit.  Football is all about winning.  You can have as many entertaining draws as you like, you won't ever get success with that.

It's no really about winning . I don't get upset if we lose, unless we were unlucky or got cheated out of a victory, like the Falkirk Hippolyte game a few years ago. I like to be entertained. I used to watch Arsenal in the 89/90 season when they won the league 1-0 . It was really dull, especially when I didn't really support them. I've only been to EEP once this season v ICT and I would have to say it was a decent game to watch. It's about enjoyment. 

 

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Give me a team winning 1-0 boring football within a second.

I know I'm a bit of a weirdo,  but there's parts of football that I really enjoy that have absolutely nothing to do with goal scoring. 

Holding it up in the corner, yes please.   Keepers acting like their legs have turned to jelly everytime the make a simple catch, count me in. 

Even when its being done against us,  things like the killie keeper taking the ball to the back corner of his box and doing the fake pick up routine with o'hara.

I enjoy watching a well organized defense, who will use the dark arts where needed.  That italy defensive line was great entertainment over the summer,  I know its against england which makes it funnier but how joyous was chellini's shirt pull?  

Mourinho's inter killing barca's great passing side was perfect. 

And that's before we get too great blocks/tackles or worldie saves.  By far our best moment this season was OFW stop vs rovers.  I watched chelsea scramble the ball clear for 45 minutes vs brentford and enjoyed the pure class of mendy to win it for them,  whilst also appreciating the convenient injuries that cropped up when they needed time to re-set,

On the flip side I want to murder wingers who try to beat a man and lose the ball in their defensive third,  Lose your man at a set piece? Your for it.

Great goals are fantastic to watch,  but if I'm a neutral and a goal should have been prevented I can find myself more frustrated at the defending than enjoying the goal. 

As I say, a bit of a weirdo,  but teams doing everything they can to win is what I want to watch.

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I'd find it difficult not to clap the side off on Saturday based on the fact we were really sh!t six weeks ago.

We were decent on Saturday against the league favourites. That's all. It's pretty obvious that being bottom of the league after 9 games and having no wins isn't acceptable but Saturday was a step in the right direction.

On a separate note, I see Montrose skelped 5 past Clyde at the weekend...

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3 hours ago, parsforlife said:

You have made most of that up in your head.

You didn't like that I called our inability to win at the 9th(ninth!) attempt embarrassing, because you want to treat every game individually and ignore the context of the season.  I consider things in the greater picture. 

We have no control over what other teams do,  they'll gain points against each other, they'll drop points against each other.  I wouldn't argue they can all win every week cos that's stupid, nor can they all lose.  What we do know is that the team in 4th place will have something approaching 27 points, maybe a bit more, maybe a bit less by the end of the next quarter, the team at the top will have roughly 36 and the ones near the bottom will be on about 16/17.  This doesn't change much season on season,  baring extreme Brechin like performances. 

Sorry for talking about anything other that didn't occur between 3 and 5 on saturday,  as this website must be neatly separated into nice little boxes...

I’m not going to argue with you any more. 

All I’m going to add is, this isn’t dotnet mate, so don’t be telling me I’ve made stuff up in my head or tell me you consider things in the greater picture as if I am beneath your level of understanding, I’ve been around football for a long time as a fan, player, coach and manager so I understand the game perfectly well, thanks very much.

Talking to people like that isn’t what we’re about. 

Also, no-one said anything should be forbidden. That is how we try and run the threads here and you’d see we often keep it tidy by merging ones that are similar or splitting ones that verge off into different topics. It’s easier if folk keep on topic, that was I declined to take it any further. 

I’ll happily agree to disagree if you are able to stop turning every discussion around to Peter Grant getting sacked.You’ve made your position crystal clear. 

 

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1 hour ago, parsforlife said:

No.

I was at east end.  Many did seem happy with Saturday,  But for me it missed the most crucial bit.  Football is all about winning.  You can have as many entertaining draws as you like, you won't ever get success with that.

There's an obvious truth in what you say about winning. 

That said I think fans are entitled to feel some level of satisfaction about improved performances over a period of games after such a horrendous start. 

We're probably not that far away from a win now....hopefully. But no matter how we cut it, it'll take nothing short of a miracle to get us out of this league this season. I've said all I have to say about Peter Grant and it looks like he's not going anywhere soon. 

I've booked myself onto our regular bus for the Arbroath game. I'll be getting tanked up before the game though 😂

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19 minutes ago, The Roy Barry Fan Club said:

I've long accepted that supporting the Pars is a form of madness. Might see you at Arbroath,  Piracy....we've got a week in Ballater and my wife is taking her own car. I thought I might take the coastal route....

Enjoy Ballater. I stayed in the Deeside Inn last year for a couple of nights. Great place. 

I'm off to Majorca on Friday morning for a week. Will miss the Partick game but there's a full minibus going to the Partick game, so maybe the recent improvements on the park are giving fans a bit more hope. 

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29 minutes ago, The Roy Barry Fan Club said:

....we've got a week in Ballater and my wife is taking her own car. I thought I might take the coastal route....

 

Lovely part of the country. Took my daughter to that area a couple of years ago and "luckily" timed the journey home, via Lunan Bay, right in time to watch The Pars at Gayfield. 

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8 minutes ago, Keyser Soze said:

 

Lovely part of the country. Took my daughter to that area a couple of years ago and "luckily" timed the journey home, via Lunan Bay, right in time to watch The Pars at Gayfield. 

Utterly convenient.

I've often found family commitments were easily manipulated to ensure match attendance, not to any detriment of the family of course. 

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